Author Topic: 📉State of the Economy: Rodney, Bandito, Items vs Taros, Mysterious Vendors📈  (Read 4903 times)

InfinitePossibilities

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I'm making this thread, so we can discuss the economy of the game.

New:






Old:
With the Halloween update out, these Pumpkin Spawns are making everyone rich. Or is it?

Pumpkin Spawns drop 100 taros each. If you use bonus gumball, they drop 124 taros each.

If you want to complete the Halloween mission, you'll need to defeat 3,000 of these mobs.

3,000 pumpkin spawns * 100 taros/kill = 300,000 taros

There's also the world mission that drops an additional 100,000 taros.

Provided you do the absolute minimum of this event by doing the mission, you will earn 400,000 taros.

There are hundreds of players grinding there at once. Some of them will continue grinding because it's a fantastic way to earn taros.

I'm happy that everyone is going to be 400,000 taros rich; however, this will affect the economy. It's not that significant of an inflation.

According to the World Nank, an acceptable rate of annual inflation is around 2%. Even if we doubled or tripled the prices such as the Solomon Hat somewhat valued around 350,000 taros, it's not that significant of a change.

2% - + 7000
4% + 14,000
6% + 21,000

A standard ultra rare of 50k
2% + 1,000
4% + 2,000
6% + 6,000

There's no need to update the Universal Item Guide price guide.


If we're talking about hyperinflation, according to Investopedia, "hyperinflation occurs when prices have risen by more than 50% per month over a period of time."

Solomon Hat + 50% hyperinflation = 175,000 more = 525,000 taros
Standard Ultra Rare + 50% hyperinflation = 25,000 more = 75,000 taros


There's definitely inflation going on right now, but the question is: Is it normal inflation or hyperinflation? If it's normal inflation, there's no need to dramatically change the universal item guide.

Outside of this, there's also a massive RIP to the Fusion Wraith set. Former value was around 600,000 taros making it the most expensive set in the game. Now, it's not. :(



Old:
It's very relevant to my item and price guide.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1vpAruFJHH7P9MheRQdu2_wFbrShFYveCLj9l7MLIieA/edit#

Although I own every ultra rare, rare, uncommon, and tradable event item in the game, I only have one of each. I never understood why someone would go beyond collecting more than four items (one per each of their 4 characters in an account) outside of purely flexing. I'm friends and accquaintances with some of the richest people in the game who own literal entire inventories of the most expensive items in the game.

I'm making this thread because there's another factor when it comes to the economy and pricing of the items. It would have to be the fact that the overwhelming majority of people don't bother collecting duplicates. Often times, when they do have duplicates, it's one or a few pieces they obtained from grinding, so they can use it as trading pieces to obtain the items they want. In fact, the majority of the people are only interested in collecting a few ultra rares such as the Ben 10 Jacket and Cannonbolt set. There's not many people who are collectionists who want to collect every ultra rare in the game. The ones who own dupes upon dupes are in the top 0.1% of the economy.

Furthermore, I'm skeptical with the prices of some items such as the S-tiers. If these items are highly valued, many people will grind them which increases the supply. Since the majority of people who do want to collect all of the ultra rares only want to collect it once or twice, the demand will be fulfilled as more people will grind them thus the value of S-tiers are lowered. As time goes on, for any grindable item, their value should also probably go down as well as more people grind such items and add them into the economy.

Lastly, with there only being one server, competition has doubled. If the competition has doubled, shouldn't the prices be doubled as well?

The economy is complicated and too big for one person to understand.

It would be nice to make this thread as a way where we can discuss prices of such items.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2019, 07:09:35 PM by InfinitePossibilities »

machinakaiser

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2019, 12:00:48 AM »
Funny enough I was going to make a theory post about how we are running out of taros.

I still have the script if anyone wanted to see it.

InfinitePossibilities

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2019, 12:05:19 AM »
Funny enough I was going to make a theory post about how we are running out of taros.

I still have the script if anyone wanted to see it.

Those taros sinks are working, devs!

machinakaiser

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2019, 12:08:49 AM »
Funny enough I was going to make a theory post about how we are running out of taros.

I still have the script if anyone wanted to see it.

Those taros sinks are working, devs!

They are working. They are working a little too much, but it's not the devs fault.

InfinitePossibilities

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2019, 12:14:00 AM »
I legit spent about 200,000 taros on those Easter eggs. I'm sad. :(
I also spent another 100,000 taros on the Alien X Mask.
Those vehicles were another 20,000.
Grinding for those Fusion Spawns and Scoria Cephalopods cost taros as well when you buy boosts, potions, and gumballs.

It's working too well. A bit too well.

Remember when those 1,200 Knishmas vehicles were 100,000 taros? I remember.

machinakaiser

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2019, 12:24:38 AM »
Eggers and buyable crates are basically gambling in this game. Problem is we are losing money too fast now.

Here is for some economics from game theory:

https://youtu.be/fDfNoCjtXvQ

We have the reverse, which is too many items.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 12:38:38 AM by machinakaiser »

Housamo_Harem

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2019, 12:57:07 AM »
Funny enough I was going to make a theory post about how we are running out of taros.

I still have the script if anyone wanted to see it.

I would want to see that Scipt.

Housamo_Harem

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2019, 01:05:54 AM »
I suppose is that people would want to spend that much on the EGGER items because it could be a good investment for them hence them explaining why they would spend 100,000 Taros for it. Secondly people would rather buy items rather than Grind them so rather than gaining 100 k Taros while Grinding they lost more than that because of trading and people were crazy on buying those jesters hat like  ???. Lastly maybe just bad decisions by the player whose gonna spend 50 k taros just for bunny ears ?

<---------------- This Guy.

machinakaiser

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2019, 01:09:38 AM »
I suppose is that people would want to spend that much on the EGGER items because it could be a good investment for them hence them explaining why they would spend 100,000 Taros for it. Secondly people would rather buy items rather than Grind them so rather than gaining 100 k Taros while Grinding they lost more than that because of trading and people were crazy on buying those jesters hat like  ???. Lastly maybe just bad decisions by the player whose gonna spend 50 k taros just for bunny ears ?

<---------------- This Guy.

At least you are catching on to the big problem.

Mega4500

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2019, 08:35:31 AM »
OH BOY. I may sometimes complain about the economy of the game and some of the "elitists" that control it, but economics has always been a fun and interesting subject for me, so here i go, into the deep end.

Everything said so far is so true, i think it needs to be fixed in some way. These Taros sinks are WAY too effective, and i will admit, as a seasoned player myself, i never expected them to work as well as they did, but then until i realized how much ive spent on items and other stuff, it slowly got to me that "yes, these sinks are actually working now".

On the other hand, as machina said, we have WAY too many items as well. Back in the OG you could store most popular or desireable items on your bank, without needing an alt most of the time, but here some even need 2 alts to store items. This is nuts.

May i remind you all of the Bday Bash? 60 new items. Cool, but these items pretty much lost alot of potential value due to how many were dropped (You could get a full inventory of those crates in like 5 mins. It really was insane). Yes the Dark Angel Wings are kinda valuable, but the amount of stock that is in the game for them right now is pretty big, that it lost alot of potential value.

Furthermore, I'm skeptical with the prices of some items such as the S-tiers. If these items are highly valued, many people will grind them which increases the supply. Since the majority of people who do want to collect all of the ultra rares only want to collect it once or twice, the demand will be fulfilled as more people will grind them thus the value of S-tiers are lowered. As time goes on, for any grindable item, their value should also probably go down as well as more people grind such items and add them into the economy.

Now i hate using tier terms and stuff like that but for the sake of this argument Should´nt some of the Event items, like the Time Squad items, maybe even the St. Patricks items, be considered S-tier? Time Squad items were only around for a month or so, and it was only during the time that the Future was out, when the playerbase was still growing. For the St. Patricks items the same thing applies, only in a much shorter time span. Only 1 day, had to get to the top to find the vendor. I dont know, thats just my take on that.

For grindables, most of the ultra rares that are grinded just get stored in the bank (yours or an alts) and just collect dust. Im saying this because... well i am one of those people, and most people do this. Otherwise they save these items and trade them to another character, either to sell/trade them away or to make their character look nicer (ive done this many times too, like giving a Mayor´s Hat to one of my other characters so they look nicer).

Lastly, with there only being one server, competition has doubled. If the competition has doubled, shouldn't the prices be doubled as well?
I´d say no actually. Yeah competition might double, but not in general, but rather with every trader/the trading community. Most people dont care or dont even know that these ultra rares exist, so they just go their merry way, maybe even finding one ultra rare on the way, and not realize their value and sell it to a vendor, or just using it personally.

Also, its Shard. Not server.

WELL BOY I DIDNT EVEN REALIZE THIS WAS GETTING AS LONG AS IT GOT. Thats pretty much all i have to say right now tho. I think this single statement from Infinity summarizes this entire thing:

The economy is complicated and too big for one person to understand.

True dat. True dat fam.

machinakaiser

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #10 on: April 04, 2019, 09:04:34 AM »
Currency is a means of a medium or a standard for value instead of trying to work out item for item aka bartering.

It also doesn't help our Warps and Power-ups also require money. (In other RPGs, items and cool-downs are used for warps/teleports)



I do have two solutions to the problem:

Have vendors buy items at better rates. (Why the heck does a lvl 36 item is being bought 300 when the NPC sells it for 2k)
Could also change the exchange rate based on ultra rares. Some ultra rares aren't even worth selling to other players and better off selling it to NPC. (It shouldn't be over I'd say 2k, but at least make it a decent price to sell to a vendor)

Make a crate that is specifically for money (Morbucks crate or something) and have the drop rate as same as a gold crate for every monsters at every level. This value can be scaled to level to make it feel worth it.
(My idea for the value of each of these crates valued at 5k at lvl 36 and for every level down. )
-If it makes it easier for the Devs, just make a item that has a certain sell value to vendors that is scaled with level-

A combination of these two would fix our money gain rate and the devs can honestly keep making money sinks to balance it out.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 09:18:47 AM by machinakaiser »

Shirouluffy19

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #11 on: April 04, 2019, 09:47:06 AM »
I legit spent about 200,000 taros on those Easter eggs. I'm sad. :(
I also spent another 100,000 taros on the Alien X Mask.
Those vehicles were another 20,000.
Grinding for those Fusion Spawns and Scoria Cephalopods cost taros as well when you buy boosts, potions, and gumballs.

It's working too well. A bit too well.

Remember when those 1,200 Knishmas vehicles were 100,000 taros? I remember.
Wasn't it 1100 speed?

Housamo_Harem

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #12 on: April 04, 2019, 09:48:16 AM »

May i remind you all of the Bday Bash? 60 new items. Cool, but these items pretty much lost alot of potential value due to how many were dropped (You could get a full inventory of those crates in like 5 mins. It really was insane). Yes the Dark Angel Wings are kinda valuable, but the amount of stock that is in the game for them right now is pretty big, that it lost alot of potential value.

Furthermore, I'm skeptical with the prices of some items such as the S-tiers. If these items are highly valued, many people will grind them which increases the supply. Since the majority of people who do want to collect all of the ultra rares only want to collect it once or twice, the demand will be fulfilled as more people will grind them thus the value of S-tiers are lowered. As time goes on, for any grindable item, their value should also probably go down as well as more people grind such items and add them into the economy.

Now i hate using tier terms and stuff like that but for the sake of this argument Should´nt some of the Event items, like the Time Squad items, maybe even the St. Patricks items, be considered S-tier? Time Squad items were only around for a month or so, and it was only during the time that the Future was out, when the playerbase was still growing. For the St. Patricks items the same thing applies, only in a much shorter time span. Only 1 day, had to get to the top to find the vendor. I dont know, thats just my take on that.

For grindables, most of the ultra rares that are grinded just get stored in the bank (yours or an alts) and just collect dust. Im saying this because... well i am one of those people, and most people do this. Otherwise they save these items and trade them to another character, either to sell/trade them away or to make their character look nicer (ive done this many times too, like giving a Mayor´s Hat to one of my other characters so they look nicer).

Lastly, with there only being one server, competition has doubled. If the competition has doubled, shouldn't the prices be doubled as well?
I´d say no actually. Yeah competition might double, but not in general, but rather with every trader/the trading community. Most people dont care or dont even know that these ultra rares exist, so they just go their merry way, maybe even finding one ultra rare on the way, and not realize their value and sell it to a vendor, or just using it personally.

Also, its Shard. Not server.


I just want to quote this because this is like the highlight for me and Thank you Mega4500.

Let's talk about UR items and event items and how I really see it right now , The most sought after items from players right now are FuseBreaker Hurricane, Big Chill Wings, Fusion Spawns (36), Phoenix Wings and Mayor's Hat and now that we only have one shard left in the game the three new items will most likely double it's price but FuseBreaker Hurricane and Big Chill Wings will stay on the top, Why ? There's a lot of factors that will affect it and the most common one is that because their limited and one of them can only be get 1 per character. BUT what if Big Chill wings is a one time event item only ? and can NEVER come back would it affect it's value ? Of course it will especially if you consider the amount of players that just joined the game who was unfortunate enough not to get the item. This specific item will grow more on value as long as the game exist but would it top the FuseBreaker Hurricane ?, that's a big MAYBE because even if you sell/delete or trade it as long as you make a new character you will have your hands into it unlike the Big Chill Wings if you weren't present in the game to get it then Bye Bye !.

And then we have the UR items, they are most unfortunate items right now and some are like "Oh wow you completed the Canonnbolt Set?, Congrats I have Dupes of Dupes of Dupes of it" and you answer like "Oh wow! do you use it?" which is pretty much what your doing is flexing at this point and seeing a player on a UR item is pretty much the norm right now. But if you were to choose on what to get on either the "LIMITED EVENT ITEM" or the "grindable item" which one would you choose ?. By this time the UR items already lost it's value and already taken by the event Items. WELL that is, if the event item never comes back but what if they did ? What if they bring back BIG CHILL WINGS in the middle of the year for a BEN 10 event ? What would happened to its value and the dupes of dupes of dupes of your items ?

That is a piece of my mind and opinion on the games economy don't flame me on it, I just have air that out.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 09:50:47 AM by Housamo_Harem »

Finn_Hornhoover

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #13 on: April 04, 2019, 10:16:02 AM »
I personally collect 4 of each item, as I have 4 characters that I want to level up and use. I’m pretty sure more than a couple of people do this.

Completionism and bragging rights are valid reasons for collecting items (even if they collect dust), and as long as players exist, there will be demand for the S-tier items, as they’re not only objectively hard to obtain, but they also have resale value that allows players to get 2+ easier to obtain Ultra Rares.

Taros inflates/deflates alongside the supply-demand change as well, taking that and human biases into account, it’s easy to see why these items don’t permanently lose all the value they have overnight. Also supply means willingness to contribute to the market by selling something at a price, and somebody getting them by grinding hardly changes prices as long as it’s as hard to get as people claim it to be. There’s always an opportunity cost associated with grinding (even if grinding looks ‘costless’), as long as people get 2-3 Ben Jackets by the time they get a single Galactic Blade (on average for all players), there’s no incentive to move the equillibrium price between supply and demand curves. The only effect that matters is people sinking a lot of Taros into events and regaining the Taros by grinding, which is an effect that naturally moves all supply and demand curves. This effect also dies down as people grind more (though, the additive Taro gain may just take over during the event gap coming up after Mother’s Day).

People generally don’t decide that something is worthless without an undeniable reason, and as you said, economics is a little bit more complex than adding two Coco Shirts together, especially in a collaborative and competitive environment. Change happens naturally. We should just relax and let the events unfold :)
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 02:49:54 PM by Finn_Hornhoover »

Sonic94

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Re: Economy of the Game
« Reply #14 on: April 05, 2019, 02:48:56 PM »
Can somebody please explain how the Big Chill wings got to be so dang rare?

 

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